Numbers Not Adding Up for Joba
Posted by Matt Sisson on Friday, February 27, 2009 at 11:16 am
I’ll say it right here…using Joba as a full time starter this season will end up hurting the Yankees and Joba. In an article I wrote for this publication, I detailed the plan the Yankees should put in place for Chamberlain and it was the same plan they were going to use before the 2008 season. With the addition of Sabathia & Burnett and Wang returning to the rotation, it makes more sense than it did last year. Chamberlain tossed just 100 1/3 innings in 2008 and the Yankees plan on limiting him to 150 innings in 2009, seems like a great plan now but how closely will they stick to that? His inning goal in 2008 was 140 innings…he got hurt and didn’t come close to that mark…does it make sense to tack on 10 more innings at this point? The Yankee front office also came out during the off season stating that Chamberlain would likely make 25 starts in ‘09…that number is now up to 30.
30 starts isn’t all that many but it is for a young pitcher with shoulder problems and what happens if the Yankees make the playoffs? Obviously they can use Chamberlain in the bullpen in October and go with a 3 or 4 man rotation, but what if there’s a mid-season injury? The smart thing to do would be to start Joba in the bullpen and play it safe. Joba wasn’t the same pitcher he was when he returned from a month or rest in ‘08. Using PITCHf/x data to track his pitch speed you can clearly see that he’s down about 5mph on his fastball.
Here is Joba’s pitch speed as a reliever before he was injured:

As you can see, Joba is consistently above the 96mph mark often times approaching 100mph.
Here is Joba’s pitch speed as a starter before he was injured:

The pitch speeds for his fastballs are again between 95-100mph.
Here is the pitch speed for Joba when he returned from the disabled list:

Joba is only able to reach 96mph a handful of times and this was after more than a month of rest.
I’ve also tracked his release points pre and post injury (see below).

Aside from the 4 pitch intentional walk, Joba’s release point is much closer to his body. When a pitcher has discomfort in their shoulder caused by the action of throwing a baseball, they are forced to change the way they throw in an effort to relieve the discomfort. When a pitcher develops shoulder tendinitis the joint becomes inflamed causing it to become weak and unstable. Joba’s release point since returning from injury is closer to the body and is likely due to Chamberlain attempting to keep his arm slot in an an effort to increase the stability of the joint as opposed to further away from the body where it can become less stable.
The change in release point, as well as the drop in velocity are two warning flags the Yankee organization should take into consideration. Joba will likely be better off being held back as a reliever but if the Yankees intend on using him as a starter all year long there are a few likely spots in the schedule where they can find time to skip a start or two. The first of these spots being in the beginning of the season during the Yankees home opener. The number five spot happens to fall on that day and with the Yankees spending so much money on both a new stadium and C.C. Sabathia, why not let him start the home opener in their new stadium?
















Nice write up and a lot of work,
One can’t really compare this year to last year because Joba started off in the Pen last yr. and for the first time that I’ve seen in 30 years, he transitioned directly from the pen to being a starter during the season without going down to the minors…
The mistake–as admitted by Yankee Management–was to start him off in the pen to begin with of last year.
I wrote about the “direct transition idea” last April, before it was announced. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/20047-new-york-yankees-joba-chamberlain-cometh-to-start-transitions-replacements.
The transition made sense. Starting him off in the pen, as opposed to ending the season there, was the mistake.
The stats are a little misleading in this peice too. As a starter, Joba uses all 4 pitches and throws more a lot more curve balls then he does when relieving. A curve requires the arm be closer to the head, and is obviously slower than the slider… Let alone the change up.
The Joba plan (IMO) will be to limit him to 150 innings again. Last year it was said to be 140 to 160. Nothing more definitive… One can imagine that he will most lilely start until August and then move into the Set Up Role as part of his inning management program–ust like the last two years. Thats all.
If he gets injured, then he will likely go to the pen premanently. If he stays healthy, then those that can–start.
In the mean time, should Phil Hughes–who threw 3 shut out inngs in relief during a play off game 2 years ago–be used in relied and maybe as the potential set up role (if earned)?? Or does he stay in the minors and stew as trade bait?
Halladay and Peavy are right around the corner…
Girardi recently said on MLBN that Joba is being groomed to be the ace and that it “might not” happen right away, but he will be a number 1, 2 or 3.
Joba, CC, Wang, Pett, AJ…righty, lefty, righty combos….
And then at the end of the season–say mid august–Joba goes to the pen and may be there for post season.
thanks for the comment…I go into a lot more depth in the article i wrote for the Maple Street Press 2009 Yankee Annual but could not include it here….why would people buy the annual? ha What I could not put in the publication was all the work i did using PITCH f/x since MLB does not allow its use for profit. The fact of the matter is that the Yankees are really handcuffed here with Joba being an ace in ‘09 because of his innings limits. You can’t just increase his innings that dramatically and expect him to be healthy in 2010. Verduccis year-after effect.